335: Sam Radocchia—Ready Or Not, Blockchain Is Not On The Way, It’s Here

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Andi Simon: Welcome to On the Brink With Andi Simon. Thanks for joining us today. I’m Andi Simon, your host and my job is to help you see, feel and think in new ways. And I like to bring to you thought leaders who are really changing the way we are thinking about things. In November 2018, Sam Radocchia spoke on our podcast about bitcoin, blockchain and the coming changes in our ways of connecting, but also just connecting, and the great transformation that was coming in.

And as you know, we’re particularly interested in both bitcoin and blockchain. We’ve had Jared Tate from DigiByte on the podcast, as well as Marton Ven from TE-FOOD International in Germany. And we’re most interested in how the track-and-trace technologies are developing, and I actually was on a TV show for the construction industry on how they are very behind in trying to get into blockchain.

So Sam came on today because she has a brand new book out, called Bitcoin Pizza: A No-Bullshit Guide to Blockchain. And we’re going to have her tell you the whole title in particular, but I love the way she’s taken blockchain and bitcoin and turned it into pizza. And she’ll give you a little background around it as well. She has a great quote to start her book: “The world as we have created, it is a process of our thinking. It cannot be changed without changing our thinking.” Albert Einstein said that.

But today is all about helping you change the way you see, feel and think, because if not, the world’s gonna go backwards. I’m gonna give you a little bit about her background because I’d like to dip right into her book today. She’s an entrepreneur, a keynote speaker and author and emerging tech advocate. Actually, the emerging is probably inappropriate. She said tech advocate, and she has delivered keynotes globally and led corporate trainings at Fortune 500 corporations, trade associations, conferences, national governments, NGOs, investment firms, and the United Nations. She really is interested in educating people on technologies and the cultural shifts that are happening. She’s also a gamer, a reformed gamer.

She started studying virtual currencies in 2009 while writing her anthropology thesis, which is why we have so much fun talking, from one anthropologist to another anthropologist, but really about technology and linguistics. And her thesis was on currency exchanges in the virtual world. She was co-founder of Chronicled, an enterprise blockchain company focused on supply chain. And while she’s still an advisor there, she’s moved off. And this book is really what is all very important today. What is Bitcoin Pizza? Anyway, thank you for joining us.

Sam Radocchia: Thank you, Andi. It’s great to be back.

Andi Simon: Tell us, it’s been about a year since we met last time. What’s happening both to Sam Radocchia and what’s happening to the book, and why should we all be so excited to eat it?

Sam Radocchia: A lot is happening. Well, again, yeah, most notably, I’ve worked for the past year, year and a half, on this book. And it really came from a place. It started almost as a glossary of terminology that you hear in crypto space, but mainly from the cultural perspective. So you know, people say these terms, like, to the moon, or hold on for dear life, or drive Lamborghinis. And they’re all of these cultural references that if you’re on the outside of the space, it can either feel confusing, intimidating or even just make no sense to you.

So I started making this fun interactive guide and had some conversations where this could be expanded into a book. Spending so much time in the space educating people, I noticed that the challenges that I found was that there was a gap between, not just explaining what it is — there are a lot of people, resources, books, speakers talking about immediately jumping into the nitty gritty of how proof-of-work works — and then everyone’s eyes glaze over. But there wasn’t a lot out there about why this is important. And beyond just the technology, why the macro, socio, cultural, and geopolitical changes that are taking place are leading to technology, decentralizing technologies. And for me, blockchain isn’t just a technology, it represents this greater paradigm shift.

And so when I think about blockchain, I’m not just talking about a distributed ledger, I’m talking about decentralization. I’m talking about distributed 3D printers making things on demand. I’m talking about AI and machine learning. So there’s a lot in the book about setting the stage for why we’re here and how we got here, even before the creation of bitcoin in the popularization of the term blockchain. It’s more about why it’s important and what have been the cultural and social shifts.

So for me, with a background in anthropology and as I have studied various groups or organizations, it just it fascinated me, as one being in the industry myself but for people who are new to it who will ask me questions about it or how to get involved or why is everyone talking on CNBC about blockchain? Or why are people changing their company’s name from Long Island Iced Tea Company to Long Blockchain Corporation? I just really wanted to help people make sense of it and feel empowered to get involved and learn more.

Andi Simon: Well, let’s stay on that. Why do you change the name of a company from Long Island Iced Tea to Long Blockchain Corporation? But I want you to talk about the name of the book first. Because the story about the blockchain, the bitcoin pizza, came from a story, and you’re a storyteller. And as an anthropologist, you know that the people listening, their brains are going to change as they listen to the story. And I love to be grounded in storytelling. So how did you come up with blockchain? How did you come up with bitcoin pizza?

Sam Radocchia: So again, it started as a working title, like many things, and I just don’t know who doesn’t like pizza. So that really was it. But in the space, there is a story. So Bitcoin, the white paper, written by Satoshi Nakamoto, an anonymous individual or group of individuals who invented or proposed bitcoin was in 2009. And shortly thereafter, in May of 2010, so not six months later, there was a programmer named Laszlo Hanyecz. And he was on one of the bitcoin forums talking to another person, saying, “I would like to buy two Papa John’s pizzas, and I’ll give you 10,000 bitcoin for it.” And so they made an exchange and it marks this historically significant transaction, where of course, there were other transactions that had occurred on the bitcoin blockchain. But this is the one that is regarded as the first real world transaction.

And the reason he says he picked pizza was that it was food and it showed the real world. You could use this for something in the real world. And, of course, it became a popular myth or story or narrative, when the price of bitcoin started going up. So you know, people in the community started celebrating this day as Bitcoin Pizza Day, which is May 22. And, you know, in 2017, the price soared, it almost hit around the $20,000 mark. And I don’t remember the exact number, but that was something around $700, $800 million for those pizzas, if he had not made that trade, and the other person on the other end of the trade, who has not come out publicly, is sitting on that money.

So it marks this pivotal moment in the industry. And so a lot of the book, and that’s a chapter that goes through these cultural myths and narratives and stories for me, that’s always been really of interest to me: the origin story, particularly in the corporate setting. So in doing my master’s, I studied a lot of the corporate anthropology stuff, and I focused on corporate origin myths. So the stories of Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak in a garage, were they really in a garage or not? Or, you know, what does that say about the values of the company?

I mean, bitcoin isn’t a company, a lot of blockchain projects are not, they’re decentralized organizations. They are more similar to religious movements, or other movements, than they are corporations. And so regardless of the structure of the entity or lack thereof, the movement, the myths and stories that we tell, particularly in respect to origin stories, are so important. It shapes everything. So yeah, pizza comes from one of those very early, very important stories. And that’s what I hope to do and have done throughout the book is tie both the technology and the meaning of the technology to these stories.

Andi Simon: But what’s really important is that we are also looking at a great transformation about lots of things, one of which is Uber and Lyft, and others like Door Dash delivering food. You can almost make a pizza in a 3D truck and print it on demand and have it delivered through a bitcoin blockchain connection, and transform all the relationships. We have changed all the ways we do things. And you open your book that way. And I said, wow, there’s something bigger than a bear here. That’s not so complicated. It’s really going to be as simple as taking money out of an ATM or using your credit card. It’s not as bad as you think, it’s actually a lot of fun.

Sam Radocchia: And again, that’s one of my favorite analogies and ways to think about this. It’s not an analogy to describe how blockchain works, there are plenty of those. It’s one that explains more of why it’s important. And I also discuss in the book when you think back to those of us who are listening who have used maps, physical maps. But remember, when Mapquest came out, there was this notion of looking at it. We’re just going to take a map and digitize it. So use a map, but online, and then Google Maps came out in 2005. And they’ve totally looked at it differently. They thought of it as an open system. They were like, this is just a set of data points, and we’re going to open it.

And on top of that, people could build any apps. And you know, we saw Uber, we saw Airbnb, we saw Yelp. We’ve seen all those food delivery companies that you just referenced, were built on top of that, that open system. And so if you can shift your mindset to think of it and look at a blockchain differently, or ledger differently, and just understand that we might not know what’s coming in the next five to 20 years, but it’s the level of change that we saw with even that small change on location information being available. I mean, it created the entire on-demand economy.

So, in the case of food delivery, I come from a supply chain background and inventory management and like, making these global systems more efficient and tracking things. And, I’ve been pretty outspoken about blockchains, the next phase of blockchain. So instead of maybe tracking things around the world, or having a pizza that’s made and then has to be delivered, to it will be produced in the back of the delivery vehicle on its way to you through a 3D food printer.

Andi Simon: And I think that’s not far off.

Sam Radocchia: You know, I mean, it’s already happening.

Andi Simon: I always love the fact that Lowe’s has, in space on the satellite, a system for producing on demand anything food-related, and it’s a revenue stream for them. If they can do it in space, they could do it in the back of your car. They could do it on demand. Russia has a 3D printer that prints a house in a day. These are all connected to this great transformation that’s coming, blockchain being one of them.

Sam Radocchia: And if we assume this is just one example, the production or manufacturing of any goods…I’ve met someone recently who’s 3D printing spaceships in space. So as this ship moves out farther in space, it just continues to print more of it, like an infinite spaceship, and this is actually happening. It just baffled me. And then I’ve met people working on 3D printing medications and food. And again, this is within the next five years, of course, with the regulatory constraints of that.

But, a blockchain in there comes in, it’s very important on the IP side to manage the design files, or the composition files, security and all of those things. So, I mean, blockchain has a role in a lot of different technological transformations. It doesn’t necessarily have to be the center point. It’s like one piece of an airplane, maybe it’s the engine of the airplane, but an engine is not going to fly itself without the rest of the airplane and the wings.

Andi Simon: I was listening to someone talk about Thomas Edison who invented the telephone, and how because his wife and her sister were deaf, he was trying to create something. And somebody said to him, “I don’t know how the funders don’t have any funding for it.” And he said, “That’s such a big idea. You’ve got to go find funding, you’re not making it happen.” Because it turned into a transformation and it keeps transforming and transforming. And an iPhone isn’t a phone anymore. I mean, how many ways can you study linguistics? How many ways can we communicate as humans, and in the process, that communication is transformational.

So even as I’m listening to you, I do think you need to tell the listeners though, a couple of case studies where blockchain is doing something differently. I’m watching it in construction, because the titles, proof of completion, all of the workflows can be streamlined and all the paperwork basically eliminated through a blockchain system. And there’s a company whose name eludes me on the West Coast who is already starting to do this, and large contractors are beginning to see the benefits of it because why do you need all that flow through including payment? But what do you see in some key areas that can at least illustrate this that it’s not so far fetched?

Sam Radocchia: So first and foremost, I am fascinated with organizational structure itself. So as the nature of organizations is becoming decentralized and mediated through blockchains, either to work on these projects or the technology itself. So when you look at bitcoin or other communities or foundations, they’re structured more like cooperatives, or they’re called decentralized autonomous organizations. And this is playing into the future of work, where first we’ve seen freelancers, the gig economy, remote work, people kind of traveling throughout the world in different countries.

And there are projects now that are creating blockchain-based benefit systems, digital cooperatives to route payments, based on your contributions to an initiative where you can work on multiple different initiatives and flow freely through different organizational structures. So that excites me, because there are a lot of implications as well, around governance. So both corporate governance, whether a company or not. A project called Decred, which is created, they manage their entire thing through an internally-built voting system. And that obviously, then has implications for the government and voting in elections on a larger scale. So that’s one area.

Andi Simon: But stay in that area just for a second as you’re thinking, because there are an estimated 50 to 60 million Americans who are in the freelance nation. I actually met a perma-freelancer. And she laughed at the fact that you’re talking about the name permalancer. She said, “I’m never going back inside.”

The world that’s arising around the services that they need, whether it’s WeWork, or restaurants that have turned into a membership club so you can come and work there. It is all this decentralized and shared economy. And I met somebody who said, “I’m never going back inside. I’m an Uber driver, I have an Airbnb, and I’m a computer programmer, an engineer, and I never want to see a boss again.”

And it’s a change in values, talking about a cultural transformation. But that’s a whole lot of people who are not looking at the unemployment numbers, as part of them. There are 7 million empty jobs in the US, only 6 million people, but 50 or 60 million freelancers, something’s wrong in those numbers. But it’s a tremendous transformation. Give us another one.

Sam Radocchia: So again, manufacturing and supply chain. So regardless of industry, the automation of business processes, so something is simple in the supply chain. Right now, there are things called bills of lading. So a lot of paperwork, just to get a package from point A to point B. And so there are a lot of companies working on automating digitizing it first, then automating it and using a blockchain to automate those transactions and release payments.

But again, where I see this really going, it’s first making supply chains more trusted and more efficient by tracking the goods on them, or tracking reputation of companies, or credit and lending. But it’s also then moving to this working with 3D printers, and using a blockchain to store the design files of aerospace parts. So instead of producing in a factory or contract manufacturer a million parts and then shipping them all over the world to sit in a distribution facility to be potentially used or not used, they just print them on demand. And those design files are actually the most valuable part of the whole thing there.

You know, it costs millions of dollars, tens of millions of dollars in R&D to create it. So the blockchain houses the license to the file. And so of course, this has implications not just for physical goods production, but also digital rights, the rights to using even my image or stock images online and automating that. So that’s a big area as well.

Andi Simon: Sam, a lot of our listeners are not going to be that clear about what is a blockchain and why this is so exciting. So the intellectual property we’re talking about isn’t floating around on computers that can be hacked. There’s a whole different methodology here that secures it differently. So share with them a little bit about what the intellectual property issues are and why this is so exciting.

Sam Radocchia: So again, for the listeners, if you think about companies, whether it’s your bank, the DMV, a brand, your online shopping brands, the way that they work right now is that they use a database and it’s centralized. That company has the control over it and that also means it’s a single point of failure if that was either compromised through a hack, which we’ve seen a lot of data breaches, or it was compromised through just an employee changing information. Even just the other day, a Twitter employee was able to compromise Jack Dorsey’s @Jack account on Twitter, which was pretty big news.

So, in the case of a blockchain, what makes it both secure, but also simultaneously trust. You don’t require trust because you’re trusting math. And the ledger is that all of that information, instead of being in a central database, it’s decentralized and distributed. So there are copies of this information on every what’s called a node or computer connection to the network. And all of those computers use math or cryptography to agree upon what’s written to it. So, is this information first and foremost, you know, the actual accurate information and then, okay, once it’s written to the ledger, it can’t be changed.

And why is this important? Because I’m sure people are like, “Okay, cool. This is of no relevance to me.” When, for me, it’s when we’re thinking about the changing world, and a lot of talk and realities of what’s going on is automation. So we’re seeing autonomous vehicles, or I’m a pilot, there’s autopilot. If the information that the machine is responding to is compromised or incorrect, it’s going to be a problem. The systems will make that decision.

So I think, first and foremost, on the data security and IP or intellectual property front, the blockchain is important. And yeah, for brands or again, if we’re talking about printing, 3D printing jet engine replacement parts with GE, it’s not that it’s just, it was expensive, in terms of R&D to create, it’s that they’re all of this metadata information that ensures the quality of that part comes out to the standards that have been tested.

So we’re talking about 3D printing, pharmaceutical drugs, or 3D printing food, 3D printing things that will impact what we consume, or that impact transportation or vehicles and safety of human beings. You know, we want to be able to ensure that quality and trust the things that we’re consuming, and certainly, it’ll be a massive improvement to our existing systems where I think that’s what led to the creation, or the need for, technologies like blockchain were these trust gaps.

Everything accelerated exponentially over the past 100 years more broadly since the industrial revolution. But, the advent of mobile phones and internet communications technologies, we became a globalized civilization overnight, and I don’t think we were ready for it. We didn’t prepare, we moved too quickly. And then the supply chains got bigger and bigger, and our communications channels became more fragmented. And now we have things like fake news. And we have deep fakes and you can’t trust even a video you see online, or like the food that you’re getting. Is this going to make me sick, this romaine lettuce?

Andi Simon: Walmart wants to protect you. And they’re putting blockchain on it or insisting that their vendors put blockchain on it. I mean, the city of Zurich in Switzerland wants to be a completely blockchain place, with all your ideas, your tax returns, all your transactions. There is something here that can be a revolution, but one that you can actually embrace and enjoy when you talk about blockchain to build a better future.

Blockchain for the better means that those of you who are listening who are nervous: relax, and the most important part is that you begin to think about this like pizza. I mean, this is something that’s going to be good to eat. Good to know. And it will be who we are and how we get along. It’s going to be transformative.

Sam Radocchia: Yeah, I mean, so I’m going to Brazil next week. And I’m giving a talk on open banking in the role of blockchain but more on the cryptocurrency side of it in a story. I’ve heard so many stories like this, but here’s one example I worked on. So speaking of the future of work, I worked with a designer that I met on Upwork. Turns out he lived in Venezuela. So Upwork is a platform to connect with freelancers and hire them. And he asked that he get paid in bitcoin. And I said, “Okay, interesting. I’m into this.” So I did.

Turns out he lived in Venezuela, and he told me his life story, that he had a master’s in design and then everything happens there and you know, couldn’t get out, couldn’t get a job, he was doing work through Upwork and getting paid in bitcoin, but started doing art online and selling that art, that digital art, which is another use case of blockchain, unique digital art and the rights to that, and he was making his money there.

I think on one hand, we have this position being in the United States and having the US dollar, a position of privilege, where we say, This might be scary, or this will never happen. But when you talk to people in countries where maybe they have less trust in either their government or their currencies or other things, you see that it is being used for peer-to-peer exchange, and the technologies are being used today. And they’re being trusted today. And so for me, that’s what inspires me, is when I meet people that are like, they’re very deeply in it, and it is making a positive impact in their lives, whether it’s providing resources for them to earn an income in a way that they wouldn’t have been able to do before, or ways to trust things like elections, in places where it seems like nowhere we can trust elections these days, but in places that are more open to it, or you know, more desperately needed.

Andi Simon: Now a word from our sponsors, Simon Associates Management Consultants. Simon Associates is us. And we love to help you see, feel and think in new ways to help you and your business grow. We specialize in applying the tools and methods of anthropology. But we’re also entrepreneurs and business builders, and we like to share our experience and expertise with you. So if you’re stalled, or stuck, or starting up, give us a buzz and let’s see if we can help you as well. You can learn all about us at Simonassociates.net and read my book, On the Brink: A Fresh Lens to Take Your Business to New Heights, and learn about it. And Andisimon.com has a free chapter you can download, and a toolkit you’ll find very helpful. We’re on Amazon, and you can buy it as a book and ebook or even an audible that I recorded myself. We look forward to hearing from you at Simonassociates.net or info@Simonassociates.net is right to us. Now back to our podcast.

You know what you’re talking about is an inflection point. And I can’t emphasize it enough, there are enough dots in the conversation and enough changes that are coming, whether it’s track and trace, or it’s this gentleman in Venezuela with a fragile economy where he can get paid in bitcoin, or with construction folks who can use this instead of bills of ladings and get paid as they complete a project. I mean, there’s something that when you begin to multiply is going to be transformational. As we wrap, two or three things that you want the listeners to remember, as well as to buy the book, because I think you’re going to enjoy reading it. Two or three things that are really important to stick.

Sam Radocchia: So the two things I think about, and it’s a great way to end is, first and foremost, blockchain is fundamentally a shift in mindset. So if you aren’t even into technology, not like a nerd like me, at least embrace the fact that we’re at this, as you said, inflection point, or pivotal moment in human history. And I believe that, I’m not just saying this, where our every system is changing. And the paradigm shifts are from centralized to decentralized systems, or closed systems to open systems, are opaque to transparent. I mean, the shift is massive, and it will impact everyone in every industry in the way that people organize an exchange.

So first and foremost, just recognize that and whether it’s a blockchain or we call it something else, or it just is more broadly decentralization, it’s really impacting everything and working with multiple technologies. And I find that exciting.

So the second point is, I approach it from an abundance mindset, not a fear-based mindset. So we have a lot of narratives in the public discourse: fear-based narratives around technology, around automation, around change. You know, I give talks to rooms and it’s 800 accountants saying, “Well, we no longer have a job,” or it’s, you know, people. That’s the common question. And I think if you flip the mindset to an abundance mindset, saying, This is a technology that yes, it will change things. It’s you know, autonomous trucking is getting rid of one of the biggest jobs in the United States. And while that’s scary, that’s also you know, if we do our part in creating more equitable systems, it could actually really make a difference in a lot of people’s lives in a positive way. So those are the two things for me that excite me about this space and why I spend so much time working in it. And I hope that that’s valuable to the listeners.

Andi Simon: Now. Tell us about the book and where they can get it.

Sam Radocchia: So the book, Bitcoin Pizza: A No-Bullshit Guide to Blockchain. It is available on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Google. Look at any of the standard outlets, as well as my website or you can go to Bitcoinpizza.com. I will say there’s a surprise at the end of the book, or if you buy the hardcover, that allows you to get your hands dirty and get your hands on a pizza, and learn a little bit more about bitcoin and blockchain. So we’ve partnered with a great company to help you learn how to show us some of the tools.

Andi Simon: Giggling I am, if we can bring it down to, you can buy a better pizza and have it at your house and pay with bitcoin and not worry about anything. The dots, though, are coming together into something that is bigger than just simply a little of this. It’s not an incremental-ism. This is transformational-ism. And people think about the future. We were just rated in the top 20 futurist podcasts. And I didn’t know I was a futurist. But that’s the third time in the last two months I’ve been called a futurist.

So there’s something about the better future of work, the future of production, the future of transportation, about restaurants, not having people eat in them, but having them prepare food to be delivered to their home. There’s some interesting dots that when you connect that are really exciting.

Sam Radocchia: They are so exciting, there also, again, they bring up a lot of anxiety for people like even that example, when you say, okay, if restaurants become these shadowed kitchens that just deliver different brands to you that don’t actually exist. What, well, what was that? I mean, eating is such a culturally important and significant thing in human society, like, that’s the bait. So what happens if people are no longer gathering in communal spaces to do this, and so what excites me and what I am working on is using this technology to reinforce the connections with yourself, with your community, with other people and with the products you consume, and with the environment.

So as we see, both, you know, the gaps and all these exciting things happening and questions around the future of all of these different areas of society and life, there is so much room to make those experiences better, and restore those connections that maybe the internet and social media and other technologies kind of went haywire and pulled them apart. So, I’m really optimistic and excited for the future. I think that’s the only way we can be, and have that mindset, and use all of our powers and of storytelling and of building and listening to make a better future.

Andi Simon: It’s been such a pleasure, I’m so glad you came back to share with us. I’m glad you wrote the book because it’s a great book. And I also think that there’s a great transformation coming that you can find blockchains for the better. But also, the future becomes optimistic and not terrifying. You know, you might as well wrap your arms around it and stop wishing to go backwards.

Every client who hires us starts out by asking us to help them change and immediately tells us why we don’t do it that way. We say, “Well, that’s the whole point. Don’t do it that way. It’s time to change.” “But I don’t know how to change.” “Well, just let’s go with the flow a little bit and open your mind.”

Now we started with a quote from Albert Einstein: “The world as we have created is a process of our thinking. It’s a story in our mind, and it cannot be changed without changing our thinking.” Today, it was all about thinking together. It was Sam Radocchia and I will tell you, her book is fantastic. So pick it up on either an electronic book or a hardcover. And then maybe we can figure out how to make it.

I’m also an anthropologist, and as Sam will tell you, our job is to help you step out and see what’s happening and better understand it. So keep sending us your emails at info@Simonassociates.net and keep coming back and sharing with us the ideas that you have so we can share them as well. Thanks so much. Have a great day. Bye now. When you share it around and I can help you enough to see, feel and think in new ways, and if that’s about the future, then I am happy to be a futurist.